Letting Gravity Take the Pole- a discussion

[ArcadiaPV]

An interesting area of the vault that I have not seen a clear consensus on, is how one lets the pole drop from the beginning of the run until take off. I’ve adopted a freefall method with my vaulters and have had quite a lot of success with it. I have been experimenting with my athletes on different length poles to determine how much time it takes for the pole to drop from a 75 degree starting angle to parallel(an instant before right support).To clarify, this is letting the pole drop completely on it’s own. At no point do I have my athletes use their arms to delay or stop the downward motion of the pole. The idea behind it is, that irregardless of how fast or slow the vaulter is running the pole will still be dropping at the same rate. The only variables that will affect the rate it takes for the pole to reach parallel is the starting angle and the length of the pole. My roommate and I created a simulation computer program to test this out. Here is an example of what we found.

With a 14 foot pole it will take apox. 1.2 seconds for the pole to drop from 75 degrees to parallel. Therefore if the vaulter is running at 9 mps, the athlete will have covered 10.8 meters or 35.4 feet in the time it took for his pole to reach parallel from 75 degrees. If the mark for the right support , or slightly before it Is known, lets say 19 feet out from the box. Then we add 35.4 plus 19 and we get a pole drop mark at 54.4 from the box.

With a 15 foot pole it takes 1.4 seconds to fall. Using the same variables as the previous example the vaulter would have his drop mark at 60.3.

Many people use their 4th left out as the approximate time to let the pole drop. They do this because it is around the 45-55ft. zone. If a vaulter knows his meters per second(MPS) and the falling rate for his pole, he can pinpoint exactly where he needs to let the pole drop instead of estimating.

I’ve found this method of letting the pole drop very helpful in the transition to a longer pole as well as helping set up for the take off. The pole is weightless throughout the run, meaning that at no point does the pole slow down or strain the vaulter. This is especially helpful with longer and heavier poles. Many vaulters try to hold the pole parallel in the last 2 steps of the vault. For many this causes them to turn their shoulders to lift the weight of the pole, and thus slightly effect the efficiency of their run at the most important part, the take off. Also, if the right arm is lifted before the pole reaches parallel the pole will not bounce whatsoever. Anyone can try this out by standing and letting the pole drop. If you raise your right arm too slow the pole will bounce. If you do it at the right time the tip will not move at all.

I find this technique most helpful when a vaulter is transitioning to a longer or heavier pole. It’s no longer such a drastic change running down the runway. Let me know what you all think and if you have any questions!

[altius]

"With a 14 foot pole it will take apox. 1.2 seconds for the pole to drop from 75 degrees to parallel. Therefore if the vaulter is running at 9 mps,"????

I suggest that if an athlete can run at 9m/s they should be using at least a 4.90 pole.

Also suggest that the athlete should never think of having the pole parallel with the runway - it should only be passing through that position in a continuous movement as the top hand rolls up the right side while the bottom hand acts as a fulcrum for the rotation of the pole.

While a free drop seems to work for you I believe it is better to think of it as a controlled lowering of the pole where gravity does not take over. A free drop will create problems with the planting action over the last three steps as the athlete tries to regain control of the free falling pole. But as a wise man said - just my 2 cents worth.

[Tim McMichael]

In my experience, most problems with sinking and overstriding are caused by problems with lowering the pole. If it ever stops moving completely the vaulter will sink and overstride as the weight of the pole ruins their posture.

This is definitely an area of technique that needs some study. There are a number of methods that I have seen work, fee fall being one of them. The stiff pole vaulters who were the inspiration behind Petrov's innovation carried their poles parallel to the runway with very wide grips which they narrowed during the plant phase. Warmerdam had an excellent takeoff in spite of this. What was going on there? If this was the standard method for a century or more, why has it changed so dramatically in the fiberglass era? How exactly do the various methods effect the movement of the plant? What the left arm does as the pole plant begins varies a great deal from one valuter to the next, and this is a direct result of the pole carry. Is this something that needs more focus from coaches and athletes?

A lot of questions there.

[achtungpv]

The stiff pole vaulters who were the inspiration behind Petrov's innovation carried their poles parallel to the runway with very wide grips which they narrowed during the plant phase. Warmerdam had an excellent takeoff in spite of this. What was going on there? If this was the standard method for a century or more, why has it changed so dramatically in the fiberglass era?

I read this in an article way back in the 80's...

Petrov got the idea of the a high tip pole carry from an old Soviet vaulter who lost a hand in WWII. He had to carry the pole tip up since he was missing his bottom hand and could only balance the load on his top hand. Petrov noticed that his last few steps and take off were superior to other comparable vaulters and felt it was the different pole carry that caused it.

[Barto]

"The idea behind it is, that irregardless of how fast or slow the vaulter is running the pole will still be dropping at the same rate."

This is not correct. The faster the athlete is traveling down the runway, the slower the pole will drop.

For what it is worth, I teach what I call a "harmonious" pole drop. The pole must drop in harmony with the vaulter's posture as the vaulter accelerates down the runway. The pole and vaulter's upper body will be near parallel to each other out the back and progress to near perpendicular to each other one step before penultimate. The rate at which this happens is affected by rate of acceleration and efficiency of posture during acceleration.

I am very excited to hear this topic being discussed here. I feel that the pole drop is the limiting factor in 7 out of 8 vaulters' technique. If you can not get the pole to near horizontal before penultimate, then it is almost impossible to take off with significant force.

my 2 cents

[AVC Coach]

Interesting discussion! I preach to my kids that the pole drop and plant are in direct relation to the cadence of the run. If the steps are quicker close to the box, the pole drop and plant will correlate with that cadence.

[polevaulter08nw]

Not that i have too much expertise**? but i feel that the controlled yet gravity assissted pole drop, as said, would and is most effective. Considering the ideas of the length of the pole and speed of the runner, the pole shouldn't be just dropped and shouldn't be carried cause it would very well change the perfered running technique and slow the transition into the plant. This could go into more physics, but some times i wonder why explore something to an extent if its working. i do agree with reevaluating technical aspects to check and find any errors which there could be many found in this, but i also feel that the coaching of the pole drop is very important for all vaulters, but especially in beggingers for a good start in the sport. Otherwise many wrong things can happen as they do. Fixing these problems would obviously benefit everyone! haha but too many over look the importance of this aspect of the vault. i know i have to an extent.

my half cent? haha

[ArcadiaPV]

I'm glad I got a good response.

Altius- I was using 9m/s as an example. most of my athletes on 14 foot poles are running around 7.6 m/s to 8m/s.

Also, their pole is never parallel to the ground, it is moving past that point. I was using the point where the pole is parallel for a split second as a reference point to calculate the time in which the pole fell.

To clarify, my vaulters let the pole drop completely on its own, but they direct the fall without using any stopping pressure. This allows them to really set up for an excellent take off. Their hips don't dip from the weight of holding the pole making for an easier trick step.

Barto- I originally thought that a faster runner's pole would drop slower too, but that isn't the case. They are just covering more ground from their increased speed and as a result they have to move their step back to compensate.

[Barto]

Barto- I originally thought that a faster runner's pole would drop slower too, but that isn't the case. They are just covering more ground from their increased speed and as a result they have to move their step back to compensate.

I'm not sure who your high school physics teacher was, but they should be fired. The pole will fall at a slower rate if it is moving toward the direction of the fall. period.

[jumpbackin]

Barto- I originally thought that a faster runner's pole would drop slower too, but that isn't the case. They are just covering more ground from their increased speed and as a result they have to move their step back to compensate.

I'm not sure who your high school physics teacher was, but they should be fired. The pole will fall at a slower rate if it is moving toward the direction of the fall. period.

Barto, I agree with you but I don't think the HS Physics teacher should get fired. All intro Physics classes discount wind resistence. They just kind of pretend air doesn't exist!

[Rhino]

Go ahead and fire the physics teacher. Air resistance is not necessary to hold the pole back from falling. As a matter of fact, if the run is fast enough, the vaulter would outrun the top of the pole and it would fly over his shoulder!

[Barto]

Beam Theory?