Season Opener: Outdoor PR 15'

[joebro391]

First meet of Outdoor, my freshman year in college. Wasn't sure how this meet was gonna pan out (due to pole-restrictions), but i pretty much knew I was going to be going from a shorter run (though, I wanted to try and go to a 7-left approach). Unfortunately, I woke up sick, throwing up and wasn't even sure if I'd have any speed to vault. Meet was at my home-facility though so that was nice. Somehow I mustered a 6-left run and had a pretty decent day. I like some aspects of these jumps, but not all; let's review...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOQzp8rpOGU

JUMP 1: Step was around 10'4 when it should have been around 11'3, so I was obviously under on this jump. I also don't think I ever got the plant up fully (bent top arm, which i sadly do, often). Good knee-drive and swing, though my bottom arm looks pretty weak. Swung to inversion without any flat-back and finally seem to be finishing the extension before starting my pull-turn phase, however, I am getting too far away from the pole during the latter phase and this causes me to flag-out a bit. No passive phases leads to very nice 'pop' off the top of the pole.

JUMP 2: Step was at 11'6 this time so that was good, however, I don't feel I really jumped too well at take-off and this caused a pretty big sink in the pole. Pretty good swing to inversion though and I get a pretty good return from the pole again, however I'm still flagging out. It's weird, cause from this angle, it looks like I'm getting away from the pole worse on this jump than the last, but I don't think I flagged out as bad. Not sure.

JUMP 3: Take off was around 11' so I was a bit under, however the take-off looks pretty good (UNTIL THE SINK). it's weird, because the take-off looked decent (aside from still not getting my top-arm fully extended), but then there was this sink in the pole and it looks like I just swung under the pole instead of while rising with the pole. Still a nice swing-to inversion (however, i don't like the break in my trail leg, between take-off and when I begin my swing. Any thoughts on this??) and a decent top end with some nice pop from the pole.

JUMP 4: Didn't think the 15' 150 had enough in it to put me over 4.70, so I moved up (only about 2 lbs or so) to our 15' 155 Pacer. Step was about 10'9 however I really like the position I hit at take-off, however, I feel that because my trail-leg breaks shortly after it leaves the ground, my hips start to swing under the pole prematurely. Powerful swing and get my ankles to my hands but I really flag-out on this jump and go into the bar. I believe that at the time, i felt this was a blow-through, though after reviewing the footage, I see this was not the case. Perhaps I should have stayed on this pole for another jump and really tried to stay close to the pole instead of moving to the 15' 160 on the next jump.

JUMP 6: take-off was at 12' which is what it should be around for a 14'2 grip. Good knee-drive but weaker swing and hesitation caused flat-back and passive phases (the 'V') in the jump and in return I received no pop from the pole (I think i was hesitant due to the increase in grip [5 inches) and I wasn't sure if i was going to make it into the pit or not, as this is usually my big 7-left pole].

JUMP 7: ran myself under to about 10'11 and that just won't work on this pole haha

All in all, I can't be disappointed. I woke up sick and throwing up and tied my PR (jumped an outdoor PR) from 6 lefts.

THINGS I FEEL I NEED TO WORK ON:
1) Jumping up better at take-off (any tips? this has been troubling me lately)
2) No break in the trail-leg between take-off and when I start my swing
3) Stronger bottom arm
4) Staying tighter to the pole during the pull-turn phase and not flagging out

Comments are appreciated. Thanks. -6P

[KirkB]

6P ... nice ... very nice!

You're really flying ... nice run ... nice plant ... smooth takeoff ... nice swing ... nice inversion ... all-in-all, it's really coming together for you!

Focusing just on your 15-0 jump (highest clearance) ...
Your takeoff isn't UP enough ... it's too horizontal ... and you're not JUMPING off the ground hard enough.
Your trail leg bends too much during the backswing ... the straighter the better.
As a result ... your upswing is still a little lackadaisical ... it could be smoother and quicker. This will come when you fix your takeoff and downswing. You ARE passing thru the flat-back a LOT better than in the past.
Lots of clearance over 15-0 ... nice!

My comments above were BEFORE I even looked at your self-analysis. I like to analyze a vault independent of other opinions ... to avoid any bias. Here's your comments ...

JUMP 3: Take off was around 11' so I was a bit under, however the take-off looks pretty good (UNTIL THE SINK). it's weird, because the take-off looked decent (aside from still not getting my top-arm fully extended), but then there was this sink in the pole and it looks like I just swung under the pole instead of while rising with the pole. Still a nice swing-to inversion (however, i don't like the break in my trail leg, between take-off and when I begin my swing. Any thoughts on this??) and a decent top end with some nice pop from the pole.

THINGS I FEEL I NEED TO WORK ON:
1) Jumping up better at take-off (any tips? this has been troubling me lately)
2) No break in the trail-leg between take-off and when I start my swing
3) Stronger bottom arm
4) Staying tighter to the pole during the pull-turn phase and not flagging out

Now ... to compare my comments to yours ... I think you've pretty much identified the crux of my critique. Shows that you're already keenly aware of your faults ... and now just need to figure out how to fix 'em.

The pole is sinking becuz it's too soft. You can move up a pole ... but you need to jump harder on takeoff to compensate for the stiffer bend. Think of jumping up into the pole as a way to improve your pole angle when the pole hits the box. You need to jump up to that imaginary point in the air ... just as if you're jumping up to dunk a BB ... but without the flat heel, of course.

Jumping is not just with your leg ... it's also with your arms. So when you propel youself UP ... with your legs AND your arms ... you'll be reaching for that imaginary point in the air when the pole is going to hit ... thus your REACHING action is going to straighten your top arm ... giving you a more optimal plant/takeoff.

A combination of jumping higher ... with a stiffer pole ... is going to eliminate the sink. It's also going to force you to be more vigorous in your downswing. You will NOT be able to wait for the hitting of the pole to swing you forward ... you'll have to initiate this action yourself ... in time with the pole hitting. Be ready for it!

And yeh ... you need to keep your trail leg straighter. Practice this on the highbar ... ALWAYS!

And yeh ... you're getting some nice air off the top. This is only the beginning! This is the FUN part of all the hard work! Enjoy it ... and yearn for more ... more air ... more air ... never be satisfied with a low pushoff! Remember that this all comes from the bottom half of the vault ... not to mention the run, plant, and takeoff!

You still have a SLIGHT hitch in your continuous motion thru the flat-back. I wouldn't worry too much about it ... just keep your eye on it ... and know that it will disappear once your takeoff and downswing improve.

Stronger bottom arm? Suit yourself, but I personally don't see this as an issue. I'd prefer to see you have a more powerful trail leg WHIP.

Staying tighter to the pole? For 15-0, it's fine. When you approach 16-0 and 16-5, you'll find that your body will just naturally tighten up closer to the pole ... it HAS to. Another way to look at this is ... if your downswing was more powerful, then you'd invert quicker, which would put you in a position to shoot more towards 12 o'clock. It'll come ... don't stress over this fault ... yet.

Actually, I really, really like how you land near the back of the PLZ with standards at 80. You're setting yourself up for some much better extensions in the near future. Why? Becuz you now know that if you shoot to 12 o'clock, you won't stall out and miss the pit. This self-confidence is worth MUCH MORE than increasing your pole weight by 5-10 pounds. Technique first ... flex second ... as you're doing. Keep it up!

You're going to have a very good outdoor season this year, 6P ... you've improved so much already ... and I see bigger and better things to come!

Kirk

[joebro391]

Thanks Kirk, always a great confidence-booster to hear such compliments from you. It's also a good thing that we see nearly 100% eye-to-eye (aside from bottom arm). though I hope you know I'm absolutely against blocking out. It's more so to just keep my lower body 'back', so i can swing more powerfully. But of course, I can probably achieve the same thing from a proper forwards-lean and keeping my trail-leg back during my take-off/up-swing.

I have a question about jumping though. I always try to jump up at take-off, but I've found that when I really try to jump, i start to lean back. I feel like it's always one or the other (not that I want it to be this way), but I always find that if I really jump up, I lean back and when I have a proper forwards lean (and I'd say my lean from this past meet was pretty good), I don't jump up well. Any ideas on how to get the best of both worlds (like Bubka)?? Thanks Kirk. -6P

[KYLE ELLIS]

Any ideas on how to get the best of both worlds (like Bubka)?? Thanks Kirk. -6P

Yes, fix your pole drop and run... Late drop + long last strides= poor takeoff

[KirkB]

If you actually feel the weight of the pole pulling you down in your last couple steps, then I would agree with Kyle. I can't actually see you leaning back or not dropping it soon enough ... hard to tell without slo-mo vid ... what's more precise is if you FEEL the weight of the pole ... not whether an outside observer can SEE it or not.

... I hope you know I'm absolutely against blocking out. It's more so to just keep my lower body 'back', so i can swing more powerfully. But of course, I can probably achieve the same thing from a proper forwards-lean and keeping my trail-leg back during my take-off/up-swing.

OK, but you worry me when you say "so to just keep my lower body 'back', so I can swing more powerfully." You make it sound like you want to get into a C ... pause ... and then swing. The word "keep" is the one that worries. That's not it. As you know what I've told you in the past ... you need to pop INTO the C ... and then IMMEDIATELY ... if not sooner ... pop out of it again! And you answered your own question ... as long as you have good body posture on takeoff (forward lean) ... and let the chest go thru ... as your trail leg stretches back ... then you can easily pop into the C without any additional work from the bottom arm.

I have a question about jumping though. I always try to jump up at take-off, but I've found that when I really try to jump, i start to lean back. I feel like it's always one or the other (not that I want it to be this way), but I always find that if I really jump up, I lean back and when I have a proper forwards lean (and I'd say my lean from this past meet was pretty good), I don't jump up well. Any ideas on how to get the best of both worlds (like Bubka)??

Again ... your penultimate looks OK to the naked eye ... but if you FEEL yourself leaning back at all, then you're probably "gathering" yourself during your penultimate step ... much like you normally would in dunking a BB. This is incorrect. It's important for you to keep your forward lean and stay on the BALL of your foot (not the heel) ... as you "gather" to jump more vertically (and less horizontally). It's easier said than done, but one clue is that you don't want your body to be a bowl of mush when you do this ... you need to have a very, very RIGID body, so you almost BOUNCE off the ball of your foot.

This is actually easier said than done ... and it would be OK to let the heel touch down ... as long as you're not putting a lot of weight on it. You need super-strong calves (which I had) to stay rigid without any weight on the heel. It can be done ... but only after years of lifting (and in my case ... HJ LJ TJ).

I doubt you have much LJ or TJ experience, so maybe you can't relate to this much. But you can lose a lot of energy into the ground if your "bounce" off the ball of your foot isn't "tight". This is NOT the way you'd dunk a BB!

Kirk

[KirkB]

6P ... take a look at what DJ posted today on the "takeoff angle and beyond" thread ... here: http://www.polevaultpower.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=19430&start=36

It relates quite well to this issue of making the takeoff more powerful ... with a good penultimate step, and a strong "up" impulse.

I would even venture to say that the takeoff ... the striking of the takeoff foot on the ground ... is what separates the boys from the men ... more than any other aspect of the vault.

Sure, you need to have a fast run ... and sure, you need a strong swing ... but if your takeoff ... the timing, force, and direction of your takeoff foot striking the ground ... isn't optimal, then your entire vault is sub-optimal. It's so important that I think I'd lose a couple of feet off my PR if I didn't have a SUPER-STRONG takeoff.

Said in the negative ... there's more potential to lose energy from the vaulter-pole system in your takeoff than in any other part of the vault!

You're in college now, 6P, so weights, weights, weights ... especially in the off-season.

Kirk

[joebro391]

Thanks Kyle and Kirk. I'm going to read that thread right now and probably forward the link to my coach as well. Any lifting exercise you'd recommend from personal experience that helped you Kirk? I always did plyo's for this sort of thing (you can go back and look on last year's training blog). Thanks. -6P

[KYLE ELLIS]

I see 2 main things, 1 a break in posture and forward lean to get your run started. This Causes you to be off balance and to be "pulled" towards the box for the rest of the run.
2nd the pole tip is too high 3 steps out. THIS WILL ALWAYS cause problems, and all of them lead to decelerating.

Kirk,
The vaulter doesn't have to feel the weight of the pole to run into problems. If the tip is not close to parallel 3 steps out, an error will occur. The hands and feet work together, the faster the hands go up the faster the feet go down.
2nd-Also I think the penultimate should be of little concern in any of the jumps... A penultimate occurs naturally whenever anyone is jumping; and if you ask me if they sprint correctly and have the correct concept of "jumping" then they will have a good, natural penultimate. - just an opinion
Lastly you suggest weights to help out, what sort did you have in mind? I can think of something a little more specific called "plyo's".

[joebro391]

I see 2 main things, 1 a break in posture and forward lean to get your run started. This Causes you to be off balance and to be "pulled" towards the box for the rest of the run.
2nd the pole tip is too high 3 steps out. THIS WILL ALWAYS cause problems, and all of them lead to decelerating.

Any particular 'cue's' you have in mind?? Launder liked to have the top hand, about 2 inches above your head, 2 steps out. Anything more than that? I kinda always wondered where the pole should be, before the last 6 strides of the run. And I think Dave Butler says the pole should be parallel to the ground, 3 steps out (before the plant). It's been troubling me lately and since my coach has no clue about it so I've sadly, kinda just been winging it and shooting for a natural, free pole-drop. -6P

READ THE THREAD: my head kinda hurts...though honestly, I don't think i learned much that i didn't already know. Most of that thread seemed like a pissing-contest and I should have just read page-for, for dj's two pr three posts were the most relevant to my conundrum. I did pick up some important info on pole drop (regarding timing and cue's) and got some good drills from Vault3rb0y. Launder always liked this one, i think: two standards set up, about a foot and a half above my maximum reach with a bungee across them. Then I run and plant under the bungee and see how close I can get to touching the bungee. Any other thoughts?? I'll keep everyone posted.

[tsorenson]

Kyle Ellis nailed it...you are overstriding into the plant. The problems that develop throughout the meet correspond to your efforts to move your step out further (moving your run back). Look at your stride length and frequency...your cadence is maxed out about halfway through your run and you don't quicken your steps at the takeoff. Your first vault was your best looking one because you were starting from 78', which is closer to where you should be starting your run once you don't overstride at the end. Because thought you were under, you moved your step back signifigantly and subsequently overstrided even more, causing you to lose even more upward impulse at takeoff and lose your hips, then eventually bail out. You need to accelerate gradually from a relaxed initial pace to your maximum turnover rate at the takeoff.
One drill that will help you a lot: run with a pole over a series of 15-20 mini-hurdles set about 1 meter apart, focusing on achieving maximum speed with high pole carry, high knees, and good posture. Once you have passed the last hurdle, (without slowing down) lower/plant the pole and take off in six total strides. This will teach you to run with good posture and move your feet/hands a lot quicker at the plant than you are now, setting you up for a better takeoff. Alternatively you can run in between the yard-markers on the football field if you don't have mini-hurdles.
Good luck,
Tom

[joebro391]

One drill that will help you a lot: run with a pole over a series of 15-20 mini-hurdles set about 1 meter apart, focusing on achieving maximum speed with high pole carry, high knees, and good posture. Once you have passed the last hurdle, (without slowing down) lower/plant the pole and take off in six total strides. This will teach you to run with good posture and move your feet/hands a lot quicker at the plant than you are now, setting you up for a better takeoff. Alternatively you can run in between the yard-markers on the football field if you don't have mini-hurdles.
Good luck,
Tom

I must say that TO ME, it appears as though I start out relaxed and then really accelerate the cadence of my run in the last 6 strides (3 lefts). Perhaps I'm just not doing it to a significant enough degree?? And I actually really like the sound of this drill. I'll definitely give it a shot. Thanks. -6P

[KirkB]

Again ... your penultimate looks OK to the naked eye ... but if you FEEL yourself leaning back at all, then you're probably "gathering" yourself during your penultimate step ... much like you normally would in dunking a BB. This is incorrect. It's important for you to keep your forward lean and stay on the BALL of your foot (not the heel) ... as you "gather" to jump more vertically (and less horizontally).

Kirk,
The vaulter doesn't have to feel the weight of the pole to run into problems. If the tip is not close to parallel 3 steps out, an error will occur.

I don't deny that ... but if you feel the weight of the pole too much, then you have bigger problems than when you DON'T feel the weight. I was just focussing on the more important ... the more basic ... pole drop problems. Your comments are correct ... but more advanced.

Lastly you suggest weights to help out, what sort did you have in mind? I can think of something a little more specific called "plyo's".

Plyos are good ... very good ... but I was thinking of weights much heavier than your own body weight. For example, ankle flexes with heavy, HEAVY weights on your shoulders. You take the weight off the rack ... with 2 spotters ... and all you do is raise your heels off the ground. Sounds simple, but you do this with as heavy of weights as you can safely balance on your shoulders ... with spotters and with lots of shoulder padding so you don't crush your vertibrae. Instead of free weights, this excercise that would be much safer on a Universal Gym.

Another great excercise which I forgot to mention before is "stairs" ... stadium stairs. Not just jogging ... but SPRINTING, with high knees, and using ONLY the balls of your feet ... no weight on your heels. This will not only get you used to the proper takeoff body angle and thrust ... but it will also teach you how to lift your knees high on your run. When I did these, I kinda flew up off the top stair into the air ... as if the entire flight of stairs was your runup, and the last stair was your takeoff. Kinda psychs you up to get that drive into the air after maybe 20-30 less strenuous steps ... however many stairs you have in your stadium. I probably did too many stairs ... and I also did them for endurance and for rehab after ankle injuries ... but the SPRINTING stair runs are the MOST applicable to technique training for PV. Your reps should be enough to break a big sweat ... but not so much that they're not QUALITY sprints ... you need to feel fresh at the end. Maybe 10-20 reps ... depending. Incidentally, I found these to be good during peak season ... with less reps (just stay sharp) ... as well as off-season ... with more reps (more endurance).

So yeh ... a combo of plyos, weights, AND stairs. Mix it up so you don't get bored ... and so that you excercise your calves in various ways.

Kirk