5.05 bungee from a 5 step

[Andy_C]

Andy_c: we practice technique all the time it is the greatest portion of our practice. We do not get taps at every practice either. Only on the full approach day before a competition do we get taps. We only take about 4 jumps with taps. We are never depend on a tap. He only taps us if he thinks we need it.

So I guess what you're saying is that you basically use the tap in training to "simulate" adrenaline in the competition. However you try to stay away from dependency on it by limiting its use. Ok, well I really can't comment much more since I don't really know how you train. Just want to point out though that using anything in practice, from a tap to a certain type of grip tape, makes you dependent on it in competition. The degree of dependency varies but at least you guys are trying to keep that to a minimum.

Personally, I disagree with any tapping. An effort should be made elsewhere rather than to provide a tap. If your technique is good enough, you will have more than enough confidence to go on to the next pole. You should be confident enough with your technique to live without the tap entirely, even if you are struggling. I think the point of adrenaline comes in when you're a Bubka/Tsarasov/Hooker level of athlete - using massive 5.20m poles with your technique exceptionally tuned. Until then, there's work to be done on your technique. That next pole will come much easier with better technique than it will with a shot of adrenaline - the technique will be permanent and provides you with something to build so it should be the basis for moving up poles even if you are struggling! But that's not my call to make on another person's training, especially because apart from a couple of taps some time before competition, I really don't know how you guys train.

If I were to make a suggestion to you though - go to Altius' camp if you can.

All the best.

-Andrew

P.S. Just one question though, what the biggest "adrenaline" pole that you use?

[chasing6]

Then if a tap is not useful then why do i feel more confident on my bigger poles in a competition? My coach only gives us taps if he thinks we need them.Tell me why i am not afraid to get on bigger poles? because i get taps.

In what ways are the poles "bigger'? Are you talking length, flex or both? I can appreciate that feeling more confident will help you jump, but what happens when you're at a meet feeling amazing and you move through 4 poles bigger than you've ever used before? Will you freak out or will you step up and clear that big time bar?

My point is this: Even if you feel that getting tapped and getting on bigger poles during practice will prepare you for a competition, you may find it even more beneficial to put yourself in a position that allows you to learn how to adapt in a competition environment. Anything can happen in a meet, and learning to rely on your technique and not the pole in your hand is far more valuable than jumping on big sticks in practice IMHO. If you work on technique, be it on short or long runs/poles, and feel confident that you can replicate that in an condition, it won't matter that the pole is "Big" as long as it's the RIGHT pole.

When my vaulters are jumping and moving up or down poles I tell them this: Don't look at the pole as being "bigger" or "smaller", see it as the pole that will help you jump HIGHER. Forget the number and jump like you know you can. That is what this whole sport is all about after all.

I also find that taking my own advice helps immensely when moving from the 15'6" 175 that I use in practice to the 16' 185 I use in competition. I weight 155 lbs.

[Polevaulter2012]

P.S. Just one question though, what the biggest "adrenaline" pole that you use?

Well this year i will be vaulting on 16' poles but as weight and flex i do not know yet. I would guess around 190-195lbs.These are carbon fiber poles. I am also 6' 170lbs.

In what ways are the poles "bigger'? Are you talking length, flex or both?

up in flex and weight. sometimes length if needed.

but what happens when you're at a meet feeling amazing and you move through 4 poles bigger than you've ever used before? Will you freak out or will you step up and clear that big time bar?

I can easily move up however many poles i need. In my mind i just tell my self i need this pole to jump high.

My point is this: Even if you feel that getting tapped and getting on bigger poles during practice will prepare you for a competition, you may find it even more beneficial to put yourself in a position that allows you to learn how to adapt in a competition environment. Anything can happen in a meet, and learning to rely on your technique and not the pole in your hand is far more valuable than jumping on big sticks in practice IMHO.

I know that technique is more important then getting on big poles, but Its not like we are just moving to big poles.I have every pole i could ever need. We have complete series all the way up to 5 meter poles. I jump on carbon fiber by the way. Anyways we use the tap because we find it useful. We have never had any problems with athletes moving up poles. This is my second year and i still do not depend on the tap. I try and vault on all my poles with out a tap. But somedays I just need a tap. I still dont get why the tap is this big of a deal on pvp. I think the tap is useful if it is used right. Its just crazy to me that people get so fired up about this. If it is working for me why would i change it?

[vault3rb0y]

Tell me why i am not afraid to get on bigger poles? because i get taps.

No, it is a false sense of confidence. You think you can make pit because you have trained your muscles neurologically to leave the ground and expect a "boost" of energy on that certain pole. When it's not there, your muscles don't know that, and they fire in the exact same way as when you didn't have the tap. So unless you have that extra adrenaline EVERY SINGLE TIME you jump without the tap, you could come down in the box and die. The tap is more than just argued as ineffective, it's been associated with the death of a lot of pretty damn good pole vaulters like yourself. I know your coach won't stop tapping you, but you deserve to know how dangerous it is, not just get together with 5 guys in a room and let group-think take place, convincing yourselves you are looking at the vault better than anyone else.

So yea, you aren't afraid to get on bigger poles because you've gotten tapped on them before? Maybe you should be. The best kind of confidence doesn't come from false confidence, it comes from vaulting the same way you do in practice, as you do in a meet. Otherwise you are tricking yourself into thinking you are safe.

[rainbowgirl28]

A lot of it has to do with coaching philosophy. I know Dan is just giving a small tap, and not tapping every jump, and that you guys are probably not in imminent danger of dying, but there are still a lot of good reasons to reconsider getting tapped.

I don't believe that you need to practice on your "big" poles, I believe that you should use whatever pole you need based on what speed and technique you are bringing at that moment (and the conditions around you). I also think your coach can get a better view of your vault if they are not standing 2 feet away, and not trying to catch the takeoff step.

I haven't paid that much attention to your vaults, but I have been at some meets with Lane vaulters, and never thought they looked particularly unsafe. I do think the tap is a bit of a crutch for both you guys and your coach. It's a comfort thing. Maybe it's not super dangerous the way you guys are using it, but I am not convinced it's providing anyone with any benefit. I think it's a false perception of a benefit.

[Polevaulter2012]

Here is an example of how we use it.
(Standards always at 80 if not 120)
First pole 14' 180-Distance vault
2-15' 175lbs 17.8 flex from a 7 First jump
3-15' 180lbs 16.0 flex from a 7 I might stay here for a jump or two depending on how the pole is working
4-15' 185lbs 15.8 flex from 7 I will stay on this pole for a jump or two
5-15' 185lbs 15.3 flex from a 7 I will take one or two jumps on this
6-15' 185lbs 15.0 flex from a 7- Our coach will stand there if he thinks the tap is needed.If not he wont.
7-15' 190lbs 14.4 flex from a 7- He will stand there and give me a tap so that I can feel the timing on the pole. I still make it into the pit. (note: After the jump he lets us know if he gave us a big tap or not. This is so we dont get a sence of "false confidence") We understand that the tap gives us more energy so we dont get ahead of ourselves.

The tap is more than just argued as ineffective, it's been associated with the death of a lot of pretty damn good pole vaulters like yourself.

I am not worried about dying because i get taps, i know what i can do. I know what poles i need to be one. We use this as a training tool not a crutch. I never want to get a tap, our coach just wants us to be safe and get a few good jumps on the bigger poles. We have 15 pole vaulters. None of them have ever had a problem with the tap.I understand where you are coming from about the tap being a crutch but if our coach doesnt think we can vault on a pole safely then he wont put us on it. If one of the Lane vaulters die then i guess you can say it was the tap, but really it probably was a freak accident.

I know your coach won't stop tapping you, but you deserve to know how dangerous it is, not just get together with 5 guys in a room and let group-think take place, convincing yourselves you are looking at the vault better than anyone else.

I never said we think we are looking at the vault better then anyone else. We obviously have a different view on the tap then everyone else on PVP. We think it can be a good thing if used Correctly but i understand how it can be a crutch. But i Dont see it like that. You can not argue with what i think is best for me. This whole form was to give us some new insight on our form not the tap.

[rainbowgirl28]

Make things easier for yourself... next time post video from a jump in which you are not getting a tap. That shouldn't be hard to do since it's such a small percentage of jumps!

[Polevaulter2012]

Well it will usually will be with out a tap. But he had just broken a pole the jump before and our coach wanted to make sure he left the ground so he stood there for the tap. This was the only jump i taped of robby's this is why we used the tap. We will remember next time not to post a video with a tap.

[KirkB]

Here is an example of how we use it. ...
6-15' 185lbs 15.0 flex from a 7- Our coach will stand there if he thinks the tap is needed.If not he wont.
7-15' 190lbs 14.4 flex from a 7- He will stand there and give me a tap so that I can feel the timing on the pole. I still make it into the pit. (note: After the jump he lets us know if he gave us a big tap or not. This is so we dont get a sense of "false confidence") We understand that the tap gives us more energy so we dont get ahead of ourselves. ...

I'm not buying this ... at all.

If you want to get a "feel" for how much stiffer a bigger pole is than the one you just jumped on, then just flex them against the wall ... alternating back and forth between the two. Then you can compare apples to apples ... whilst avoiding the issues with tapping on a real vault.

If you think that a "real vault" with a tap is a REAL vault, then you're only fooling yourselves.

You're also fooling yourselves if you think your coach ... as good as he is ... can make a split second decision TO TAP OR NOT TO TAP ... based on how well your run and jump is going. Sure, he can gauge your run ... but the takeoff (jump) occurs so quickly before the tap that he would be VERY hard pressed to assess the situation and make the right snap decision ... on each and every vault.

Furthermore, you're fooling yourself if you think the AMOUNT that your coach taps is consistent ... consistent from one jump to the other, and consistent relative to the amount that he SHOULD tap (based on the amount of force already generated in your run and jump).

Instead of getting an OPTIMAL tap, most of the time ... I predict - I don't know this for sure ... that he will tap either too much or not enough ... relative to how much of a tap you "need". I put "need" in quotes, becuz I don't think you NEED any tap!

So instead of getting an "optimal" tap, what you're really getting is a tap of somewhat "random" force ... which adds to the many variables that you already have to deal with on each vault (run length; grip; flex; intensity; wind factor; mood; health; tiredness; etc). Why make an already complicated vault event even more complicated? Why add yet another unreliable variable to the equation?

It's a real stretch to say with a straight face that the amount of force in each tap equates EXACTLY (or close enough to make it worthwhile) to the amount of additional force you generate due to an adrenalin rush during a meet. I'm just not buying this ... at all!

... so that I can feel the timing on the pole

Really? You won't feel the TRUE timing of the pole ... you'll only feel the ROUGH timing of the pole ... WITH A TAP. This can vary quite significantly from the TRUE timing of the pole WITHOUT a tap!

Kirk

[MattM]

*note I'm a high school vaulter, so don't take my advice as law, I'm just putting my two cents in.*

Hey guys, I just wanted to say that when I first moved from a 13 foot pole to a 14 foot pole (gripping at 13 still, and we have no 13'6 transition poles) that my coach gave me some taps that day during practice to make sure that I would safely penetrate into the pit. These taps were helpful to me not in the way of gaining additional energy into my vault, but rather with confidence. Moving from a 13 foot pole to a 14 foot pole, even though I was gripping in the same spot, was a big deal for me. I was a good enough athlete to hold at that height, but without a tap, I ended up having a late and low plant which made it impossible to get on that pole. This was my first experience in having a tap, and I had no bias of it at all, and that was the only time that I've used a tap. Did this tap make me a worse vaulter? Of course not, and the additional time that I had on a 14 foot pole rather than a 13 foot pole helped me a lot. Of course you need to consider that I was only on a 13 foot pole and still relatively new to the vault, so my plant was late and low on the 14 foot pole, but it helped me gain confidence so that I would have a good plant on the other pole. This probably doesn't have much influence on the elite or collegiate vaulters, because their plant should be great regardless of them going up a pole size, but it worked for me.

[Polevaulter2012]

Have you ever used a tap?

If you want to get a "feel" for how much stiffer a bigger pole is than the one you just jumped on, then just flex them against the wall ... alternating back and forth between the two. Then you can compare apples to apples ... whilst avoiding the issues with tapping on a real vault.

Really?? are you joking? this does not give you any sense of how the pole reacts in a jump. We are not getting taps to see how stiff the pole is, But to see how it reacts in the jump because it is a bigger pole.

If you think that a "real vault" with a tap is a REAL vault, then you're only fooling yourselves.

I never said i thought it was a "real vault" when i get a tap.Yes It gives me some extra energy, so i can not consider it a "real vault" but i can look at it as a jump where i hit some good positions. I dont get a tap and go over 17' bar and say its my pr. I just get an idea of what a 17' vault should feel like.

You're also fooling yourselves if you think your coach ... as good as he is ... can make a split second decision TO TAP OR NOT TO TAP ... based on how well your run and jump is going. Sure, he can gauge your run ... but the takeoff (jump) occurs so quickly before the tap that he would be VERY hard pressed to assess the situation and make the right snap decision ... on each and every vault.

He knows how we vault. Its not like we are getting on these poles we have no chance on unless we have a tap. I have never missed the PLZ. We only will take around 4 jumps with a tap. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN AT EVERY PRACTICE!

Furthermore, you're fooling yourself if you think the AMOUNT that your coach taps is consistent ... consistent from one jump to the other, and consistent relative to the amount that he SHOULD tap (based on the amount of force already generated in your run and jump).

I never said that he taps us with the same force did i? I am pretty sure i did not. You are right though that he can not apply the same amount of force every time.It will not matter if he is consistent though because when you vault, your run and take off isnt always the same. Am i right?

Instead of getting an OPTIMAL tap, most of the time ... I predict - I don't know this for sure ... that he will tap either too much or not enough ... relative to how much of a tap you "need". I put "need" in quotes, becuz I don't think you NEED any tap!

You use "need" in the wrong way, because we do not depend on the tap. You make it sound like we do. This is just a training tool we use.

So instead of getting an "optimal" tap, what you're really getting is a tap of somewhat "random" force ... which adds to the many variables that you already have to deal with on each vault (run length; grip; flex; intensity; wind factor; mood; health; tiredness; etc). Why make an already complicated vault event even more complicated? Why add yet another unreliable variable to the equation?

how would a tap add more variables to it? because a tap will help you if you are worried about any of those. I try to not worry about anything except my form.This is probably one of the reasons you are against the tap, because you are worrying about way to much. You should be relaxed and confident when vaulting.

It's a real stretch to say with a straight face that the amount of force in each tap equates EXACTLY (or close enough to make it worthwhile) to the amount of additional force you generate due to an adrenalin rush during a meet. I'm just not buying this ... at all!

I never said that the force in each tap is the same. You are just assuming this is what i think. Like i said before, I know that it is not possible to apply the same force with the tap on each vault. This would not matter though. The reason we know it is close to what you get in a meet is because we know what poles i usually get on in a meet.

Really? You won't feel the TRUE timing of the pole ... you'll only feel the ROUGH timing of the pole ... WITH A TAP. This can vary quite significantly from the TRUE timing of the pole WITHOUT a tap!

I know you wont feel the true timing of the pole, but you will get a close idea, which is better then no idea when it comes to jumping for a new pr in a meet,And its a hell of a lot better then bending it against the wall.So i dont understand why you cant come to the conclusion maybe it works for some and not for others.

[dougb]

"it's been associated with the death of a lot of pretty damn good pole vaulters like yourself."

I have a feeling that this is an urban myth. I may be wrong but could you back this up.

2012 If taps work for you and your coach stick with them and don't feel you have to justify them to quarterbacks behind a computer screen.
Gymnastics coaches use them all of the time to teach giants.

Doug Balcomb
PV Coach, Colfax HS