USA vaulters grips?

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trayoates
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USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby trayoates » Wed Aug 08, 2012 5:46 pm

im just curious, but from looking at Walker, Miles, Scott, all of our vaulters grip extremely wide. is that true or am i just crazy, and what is the reasoning behind it.

i know that griping wider stops the swing but allows for more penetration, and from looking at their swings (especially Grande's) i can see that they dont swing the left leg through entirely, but bend it to get upside down. just wondering what you guys think about it

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby UWvaulter » Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:17 pm

From my experience, the wide grip helps control big poles(5.20s 13.0-11.0flex). Free pole drop is harder to do in awkward winds.

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby dj » Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:43 am

good morning

A grip too wide (or too narrow) will change the "physics" of every part of the vault. It changes the pole drop, the stride cadence and stride length, a grip too wide is usually paired with stretched steps, under plants, "force" bends which demands bigger poles..too big) poor swings, tucked swings and less height above the grip.. unless by chance you have the right pole, right speed, right grip that ends up letting you swing faster.

Interestingly "wide grips" seem to lead to high inconsistencies and many of the technical issues most vaulters and coaches would rather avoid.

dj

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby stavhoppare » Thu Aug 09, 2012 10:51 am

Just Remember......The highest gripper and biggest pole user was Bubka....check out his grip width. Remember this as well... PV is gymnastics on a stick. Look at the Olympic gymnasts doing giants (regular, not inverted German giants).....Their grip is perfect for the giant. Usually shoulder width and I don't mean outside to outside. It is measured from each head of the humorous bone.
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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby fishman4god » Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:26 pm

Bubkas grip width according to stats was 23". I noticed the same thing as well.....their grips semed wide. I commented on Brads 5.90 jumppre-olympics at the OTC in cali but did not get any takers :D Thught I was the only one who thought I saw it......starting to think maybe I was going crazy. I agree that a wide grip can accomplish more penetration but the trade off is not good, inconsistency, plant /take-off issues, pressing with the bottom arm issues....lots of stuff that is not really a good thing. Maybe the angle of the camera was an issue and their grips are not really that wide?

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby trayoates » Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:24 pm

well ive seen Jeremy Scott vault in person a lot and ive seen his grip (very wide!!). and the inconsistency theory was proved today with Brad's NH :(((( sad day... and yeah, ive always been under the impression that it should be shoulder width, no wider, no narrower. it seems to me that if your grip was wide, then after you rocked your shoulders back it would be challenging to then use your upper back muscles to turn/pull and pop off the pole. and if you look at a lot of Bubka's vaults you'll see that he leaves his left hand down with his right after he comes off the pole. i think that he had the perfect grip length because he could do that. Brad sometimes tucks that left arm and im not sure whether it is the wide grip or something else. just something to think about

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby Borntovault » Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:47 pm

But look at Renaud his grip is wider than shoulder width and he one of the most consistent right now. You can't say that Brad's inconsistency is due to one thing such as his grip width. I think if Brad started at a lower bar where he could afford to make a small mistake and still make the bar he would have jumped better. Understandable that Grande's grip will be wider than everyone else's because he is bigger than everyone else. Consistency comes from the run. 4 out of 5 times the person who has their run figured out the best at the meet will win.
Last edited by Borntovault on Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby fishman4god » Mon Aug 13, 2012 5:33 pm

Borntovault wrote:But look at Renaud his grip is wider than shoulder width and he one of the most consistent right now. You can't say that Brad's inconsistency is due to one thing such as his grip width. I think if Brad started at a lower bar where he could afford to make a small mistake and still make the bar he would have jumped better. Understandable that Grande's grip will be wider than everyone else's he is bigger than everyone else. Consistency comes from the run. 4 out of 5 times the person who has their run figured out the best will win.


Well the run is where it all starts for sure, I guess what we are saying/asking and of course it is all speculation at that level (which few of us has ever seen,present company included) the dynamics are intense and a small error can and does manifest itself in a variety of unsavory ways

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby VTechVaulter » Tue Aug 14, 2012 2:12 pm

derek had a wide grip, one of the most consistent vaulters of all time. jeff hartwig also a wide grip, more meets over 19' than just about anyone i believe (with the possible exception of bubka). i think pole vaulting comes down to 3 simple things. Run, pole, grip. Get those numbers to line up and good things will happen. Technical style varies based on a persons strengths, weakness, etc. Jeremy scott will never jump like Brian Hancock. I think brads "inconsistencies" if anything come from his super aggressive style. He comes in high, passes bars, always seems to be on the biggest pole possible. Renaud seems to make a lot of bars in meets (i think europeans he made like 7 bars) so he gives himself time to make run adjustments, pole ajustments, grip adjustments, standards adjustments. he gets tons of feedback in a meet.
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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby Barto » Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:02 pm

The single most common error I run into coaching young vaulters is that their grips are too close.
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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby fishman4god » Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:25 am

Yeah Barto I have that problem as well particularly with my girls. I think it is directly related to strength or the lack there of in the plant position. As a matter of fact I have never had a newbie grip really wide. That seems to manifest itself once they begin to bend and have a little confidence.

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Re: USA vaulters grips?

Unread postby dj » Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:44 am

good morning,

a "tight" grip effects the run and pole drop as well... if the run is "stretched" a tight grip effects the plant much more than a wide grip. the plant result from "tight" grip and stretched run .. is an immediate "fiber head" where as the result of "stretched" and a wide grip is a "forced" bend and delayed swing... both negative to "natural" physics.

dj


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