HS Rule on catching a pole

[master]

This was cut and pasted from the National Pole Vault Coaches Association website.

2006 NFHS Track and Field Rules
Section 5 Pole Vault
ART. 24… No person shall be allowed to touch the vaulting pole unless it is falling back and away from the crossbar. If there is a tailwind that might cause a properly released pole to fall forward, the referee should appoint an official and authorize him/her to catch the pole after it has been properly released.

I interpret the first two words of this rule ("No person..") to include the vaulter him/herself. How do others interpret this?

And for reference the USATF rule (from the National USATF site) is below.

2006 USATF Competition Rules page 102
RULE 183 POLE VAULT
6. After the release of the pole, no one including the athlete shall be allowed to touch the pole unless it is falling away from the bar or uprights. If it is touched, however, and the official in charge of the Pole Vault is of the opinion that, but for the intervention, the bar would have been knocked off, the vault shall be regarded as a failure.

- master

[souleman]

So that must mean that if we can teach our trusty dog Spike to follow us down the runway and grab the pole before it knocks off the bar then it's a legal jump. The rule does say "no person".....it doesn't say anything about Spike (the trusty old dog). Kidding aside, we've had several occasions where the pole has actually come forward and off to the side and landed right on the peg for the crossbar without knocking the crossbar off. Nobody (at our meets in Minnesota anyway) has ever argued that it was a miss because the cross bar stayed up. Even after the vaulter grabbed the pole as she was climbing out of the pit. If the bar stays up, it's a make. As long as the meet official and the coaches are consistant throughout the event, then it's a good event. Frankly I'm surprised that over the years the "catch my pole" deal has basically gone by the wayside. Back in the dark ages when I jumped in High School we always had someone catch the pole to keep it from getting damaged. Usually it was a fellow competetor. I guess things do change over time. Later................Mike

[nitro]

ive seen the athlete do it in both usatf and NFHS and neither got a miss for it

[AVC Coach]

It's a "one" person event! The job of the pole catcher is to protect the pole, not the vaulter.

[Cooleo111]

At a meet today, I saw a girl clear the bar, and her pole came to rest on the bar....when it started to drift toward the standards (where it usually knocks the bar off), she swiftly kicked the pole away from the standards. Although everyone thought that was extremely clever, it was illegal and she was warned against doing it again.

[drcurran]

You read the rule correctly "no person"! If the pole comes to rest against the cross bar the athlete should wait until the official calls the vault "good" and then remove the pole. Otherwise the athlete risk a failed vault.

Dan

[bayouvaulter]

As I see it the problem is with the rule! It states properly released...hummm
seems like every elite vaulter doesn't release their pole properly because
their poles all seem to follow them into the mat. The rule was written, no
doubt when everyone was useing bamboo poles. I agree that if the pole knocks the bar down it is a miss. Can anyone tell me why it shouldn't count if the vaulter clears the bar then picks up his pole on his way off the mats no matter were the pole is as long as the bar is up? Other then, it's the rule.
Because if that's the best explanation, then maybe if needs to be revised to
reflect modern technique.

[master]

... Can anyone tell me why it shouldn't count if the vaulter clears the bar then picks up his pole on his way off the mats no matter were the pole is as long as the bar is up?

I believe in the case you describe, it would be counted as a successful vault. This assumes that any motion of the crossbar, resulting from a pole touching it, has ceased at the time the vaulter takes hold of his pole. This is the situation that drcurran wrote about above.

- master

[Vaultref]

As I see it the problem is with the rule! It states properly released...hummm
seems like every elite vaulter doesn't release their pole properly because
their poles all seem to follow them into the mat. The rule was written, no
doubt when everyone was useing bamboo poles. I agree that if the pole knocks the bar down it is a miss. Can anyone tell me why it shouldn't count if the vaulter clears the bar then picks up his pole on his way off the mats no matter were the pole is as long as the bar is up? Other then, it's the rule.
Because if that's the best explanation, then maybe if needs to be revised to
reflect modern technique.

Elite male vaulters don't have to worry much about it because their poles normally pass under the bar with little chance of directly taking out the xbar. That being said, their improperly released pole could dislodge a crossbar should it stike the standards.

You may not have known this, but quite a few years back, if a pole passed under the bar and into the pit, it was consider a foul.

Not sure what you are driving at, but a vaulter can pick up his pole that is lying on the mat, a resting up against the standard or at rest up against the xbar once the jump as been ruled successful.

As far as that case example of the girl kicking the pole away from possibly taking out the xbar.. she gets a failed attempt AND a warning from me if I was the official at the event and felt the xbar could have been displaced.

[SelahPV]

Casey Carrigan (the Washington state high school record holder from 1969) no heighted in the 1968 (that's right, he went as a junior in high school) Mexico City Olympics due to that old rule that you Vaultref just mentioned. Thought it was a fun fact. Oh and if you are curious, the record he set in 1969 was 17' 4 1/4". I think.

[bayouvaulter]

Vaultref that's my point. A properly released pole will pass under the crossbar. I think the rule needs to be changed to reflect that. Can you tell me the purpose of the rule, since I quess from your name you are a vault official. Why pentalize a vaulter because he is trying to push down his or her
pole instead of away. If they are able to get off the mat and catch their pole before it stikes the crossbar why shouldn't it count as a make?
Thanks for your input and vast knowledge, because no I didn't know that it use to be a miss if it passed under the crossbar and it looks like that rule changed right before I started vaulting in the early 70's. Maybe we can complete what our forefathers started.

[Skyin' Brian]

I think bayouvaulter brings up an excellent point about why not allow a vaulter to grab their pole before it dislodges a bar, however, i would take it one step farther and propose that a vaulter doesnt touch the bar on the way over it should always be a make. We already give makes if they push the pole back and wind pushes the pole into the bar, and i believe that there is too much judgment calls to be made in these situations. of course, any time a vaulter "hits" the bar and then the pole finishes the job, it should be a miss.

this problem of poles knocking off bars can sometimes be pretty bad for many female and beginner vaulters. by enforcing these rules we are rewarding vaulters that do not get their pole to vertical, and penalizing vaulters that do so. this is not the right kind of feedback.

Bayouvaulter states that he believes that if the bar is knocked down by the pole it should be a miss, well i already mentioned above that we already give people makes if wind makes our poles hit the bar.

ok, i'm starting to ramble, but i really do believe that it would make more sense to grant makes to all "clearances" where a bar is only contacted by the vaulter's pole and falls off.

ok, one more example: Vaulter A vaults, pole doesnt get to vertical, vaulter hits bar on way down, bar bounces, stays up, it is a make. Vaulter B vaults, gets pole to vertical, clears cleanly, as vaulter b decends to mat, pole slowly passes into bar and bar falls, it is a failed attempt. this happens indoors. what is wrong with this picture?

anybody with me?


oh well, i guess until anything happens the best solution is dont enter a meet until the bar is no more than 9 inches below the height of your pole, so, if you use a 15'6" pole, never come in lower than 14'9" or if you use a 14' pole, never before 13'3", if you use a 12' pole, come in 11'3" or higher. i know the box is about 8", but since stands are a little behind it, the pole should pass under. not very practical for most beginners or even most college women is it?