ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

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altius
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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby altius » Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:24 pm

"This is much more feasible for professional coaches like you, altius,....."

Only time I was a professional coach Tom was 67-73 at WKU. In OZ from 1973 -2004 I worked at UNISA and all of my py coaching was honorary and unpaid - like virtually all coaches in OZ. Weekdays left work at 5 and went to the track for 2 hours -then saturday/sunday mornings 10 - ??? Was also coaching javelin throwers and a decathlete to international level during much of that period so I did not have time for clever stuff.
Its what you learn after you know it all that counts. John Wooden

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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby dj » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:11 pm

Good morning.. Tom and Alan

Sorry for the "delay"…. But I think we have come to a point that we can put some finality to what I consider and have been promoting as a successful , valued use of a six stride "check point" on the runway.

A coach mark to assist the coach in making a better "educated" evaluation to the "correctness" (speed, accuracy, form) of the approach run specific to the athlete concerned…

I would love to experiment with a detailed video breakdown of athlete's approach! This is much more feasible for professional coaches like you, altius, and ADTF. There's only so much you can do as a part-time volunteer coach with 18 credits, a night job, and three sons.


And Tom, this really doesn't "add" time… Yes I take every vaulter and long jumper to the track and "set-up" there run… after that I simply go over the run along with the jump from meet video.

I have only spent time "filming" on the track as a way to demonstrate to the athlete where I thought we needed to go with the run…, subtle changes, the first was Mike Tully and the second was Tim Mack in 1995… both were trying to "make a run" at Olympic medals and as a coach it was my job to break it down, film it, discuss it, analyze it and come up with a shared plan of attack. 99% of the time there is a immediate improvement the first day from the session on the track and the "thought" process I give to the athlete to use.. and there is generally no need to video until we get to a meet. I have had several recent state high school champions, boys and girls, that the run was all I improved. Their other coaches had taught them to vault.


I just pay attention to the cadence, hand motion, and the stride length into the plant (strongly affected by the hand motion), also the posture and the pole drop (which strongly affects posture, hand motion, and stride length).


Tom … it is just a "quick look" at the six step mark while monitoring exactly what you monitor… and I don't pay much attention to the Takeoff point.. the vaulter knows and I'm much more interested in the "impulse" and the correct "action" than the "exact" point of takeoff.

and thanks Alan for the compliment, but I think logic and a coaching tool is a better description, actually no different than you have devised over the years, is what I have done by monitoring the six step mark.

This mark was being "checked" by coaches and sports scientist before I used it to win a National NAIA Championship in the long jump, indoors in 1969.. Boston, Proctor Ter-Ovanesyan, Williams and others, or their coaches, were using the sixth step from the board as a "monitor", feedback and as a point where not only "accuracy" was important but it was very important to be "on" (close)so there would be less "steering" (chop, stretch) to the board, promoting more speed, better "posture" and the ability to attack, quicken and "jump" from the board with maximum controllable speed.

I simply do what I would always do.. watch the start, the pole carry, the push… how they get to the "MID" (six step).. check the "MID" in reference to where I "think" they should be… see what happens from there and on into the takeoff… the plant.. the jump..

I "correlate" where they were, good or bad, at the "MID" with the final result. Out of the 10 jumps at Mt Sac one year, many years ago, with Jan Johnson and Anthony Curran "betting me" a buck a jump, I predicted 9 out of 10.. Tim Bright was the only one that hit "out" but still had the speed to explode from the ground.. he blew through, Bubka like but cleared the bar on his way up…
Just like you and many others "correlate" the cadence, hand motion, and the stride length into the plant (strongly affected by the hand motion), also the posture and the pole drop (which strongly affects posture, hand motion, and stride length).

This "tool" and process could help every vaulter, Elite or beginner… I have been putting together a video but "in person" has been the best way to show it's value and answer the "hard" questions…

dj

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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby tsorenson » Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:34 pm

dj,

I would like to build a "ladder" out of nylon webbing to place next to the runway, so that we can start monitoring 6-step mids. I have seen my friend vaultwest use these by teaching his vaulters to catch each-other's mids and steps, so that he has the information but doesn't have to sit there watching it. For high school boys/girls, what range of distances will I need for the 6-step mid? I have plenty of webbing from my old climbing gear, so I can build a ladder with a 10-15 foot "range" and label it at 1-foot increments.

We've got some really talented young vaulters coming up and I want to make sure I am doing everything possible to help them reach their potential. One of our freshman girls was blowing through while capping a 12' pole yesterday from 6 lefts on her first day vaulting outdoors. Exciting!

Thanks,
Tom

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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby dj » Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:51 pm

hye Tom,

not sure what you mean about a webbing...

actully i don't do anything 'special... the runway is marked... and i will usually have 3-4 cones depending on who is jumping... the 12 footers are always between 39 and 42... a 12 foot jumper hitting 42 and not stretching, has the potential to jump 12-6 to 13...

keep it simple... set out cones, shoes or even 5" x 5" markers with numbers (i made a set with a block of wood and a nail for a peg- like the ones for shot put marking)

and just watch each jump and correlate the "mid' with the run, pole drop and jump.....

they hit 40"4" , get the feet down and zoom of the top of the pole.... !!! you have some data.. a mean to work from...

good luck i know it will help and make your job easier and more efficent.

dj

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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby rainbowgirl28 » Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:11 am

^bump

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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby coachjvinson » Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:11 pm

thank you for bumping this...
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Re: ROUND TABLE WITH SERGEY BUBKA

Unread postby altius » Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:52 pm

I reposted this piece because it is clear that many folk join in discussions on PVP without being aware of some of the critical issues that have been discussed in the past.

This session in Jamaica (in 2002) was an important session for me because I got the chance to ask Sergey questions in a public forum and get the answers recorded for posterity. I already knew the answers he would give me because I had a two hour interview with him in Munich in 1990 where I had asked the same -or very similar questions. But obviously his replies were never made public at that time and i felt it was important to get Bubka's views on the record - Kingston (incidentally sponsored by Steve Chappell at UCS spirit) provided this opportunity. If you read BTB2 you will find his replies to my questions - on the take off especially - directly quoted in the appropriate chapter.
Its what you learn after you know it all that counts. John Wooden


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