Question about "models" vs. just vaulting

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polevault5
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Re: Question about "models" vs. just vaulting

Unread postby polevault5 » Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:02 am

KYLE ELLIS wrote:The Petrov model doesn't require more speed and strength, if it did it would be less effecient. The Petrov model which was founded through a scientific scope and biomechanics was invented to waste as little energy as possible from the very first step all the way until they are letting go of the pole. The only way to hold yourself behind the pole is with a slightly flexed out bottom arm, a straight arm will make you swing right away (can't even argue that point, it is easy to prove).
Ty Harvey and Hartwig didn't just run and pole vault, if so they wouldn't need a coach. I am sure that they would even take some offense to that remark. Someone like hartwig who jumped 14'7 in high school, 17'6 in college, and 19'9 as a pro didn't get there by just continously vaulting without putting thought into it.
For a select few it isn't a question of what is the most effecient way to pole vault (Petrov being one), its a question on how to teach a vaulter the most creative way possible. Everyone likes to focus on Bubka's athleticism, but there are plenty of vaulters who are just as talented as he. What isn't talked about is that he was groomed from an early age to be perfect, he had the patience and trust to perfect drills and basic movements and progressed from straight pole drills to a full 20 stride run-up.
A lot of people still aren't close to getting it, in 5 years if you keep studying this event you will regret both of these posts (been there myself!). The farther you dig the crazier you will think you are becoming, until the light bulb goes off one day and it will see so simple!


I realize that Hartwig and Harvey didn't simply just run and pole vault, they did have a coach in Earl Bell and they were greatly successful just as Bell was. I was merely stating that they didn't really over-think the vault, they were taught what they were taught, they pole vaulted, found what worked for them and at the end of the day were successful pole vaulters. I use the same type of "system" they use when I pole vault, my club coach is Bobby Haeck, a student of Bell's. From what I have learned, the pole vault boils down to three things: the approach, the take-off, and the swing; the rest will just happen. It starts with the run being in the right spot, if it isn't, then it will be a failed vault compared to the vaulter's best. I know from experience that if the approach isn't on, then I will not have a good day vaulting. If the run is on and the take-off is solid, the swing will come more naturally and in the end, will result in going over the bar.

I appreciate all of the comments, I'm beginning to understand more of what the whole idea is behind a pole vault model.
If you're gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough.

KYLE ELLIS
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Re: Question about "models" vs. just vaulting

Unread postby KYLE ELLIS » Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:39 pm

Here is the thing I think you and a lot of people are missing, as you start digging or studying your own vault, you start realizing ok I suck at this and to fix this I have to fix the previous step.... You spend a month trying to fix the previous step and can't do it because you realize that the preceeding action before that is creating problems. So you keep going backwards and backwards until you get to the very beginning of how you hold the pole, start with the pole, and what you do with your very first step.
By this time a lot of people are going to say "screw it" and go back to what they where doing or quit. The difference is that Bubka started from how to correctly hold the pole, how to start the run correctly, and how to sprint correctly, etc., etc. and went from there. Once you appreciate the science of the sport and all of the minute but very improtant details you should be in aww of what Bubka did.

But first you have to understand the science of the sport, thats where it all starts.
Last edited by KYLE ELLIS on Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Question about "models" vs. just vaulting

Unread postby AVC Coach » Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:45 pm

Well put, Kyle! :yes:

polevault5
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Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 12:10 pm
Expertise: Current College vaulter
Lifetime Best: 5.08m
World Record Holder?: Renaud Lavillenie
Favorite Vaulter: Earl Bell

Re: Question about "models" vs. just vaulting

Unread postby polevault5 » Tue Mar 29, 2011 4:50 pm

KYLE ELLIS wrote:Here is the thing I think you and a lot of people are missing, as you start digging or studying your own vault, you start realizing ok I suck at this and to fix this I have to fix the previous step.... You spend a month trying to fix the previous step and can't do it because you realize that the preceeding action before that is creating problems. So you keep going backwards and backwards until you get to the very beginning of how you hold the pole, start with the pole, and what you do with your very first step.
By this time a lot of people are going to say "screw it" and go back to what they where doing or quit. The difference is that Bubka started from how to hold the pole, how to start the run correctly, how to run correctly etc. etc. and went from there. Once you appreciate the science of the sport and all of the minute but very improtant details you should be in aww of what Bubka did.

But first you have to understand the science of the sport, thats where it all starts.



I completely agree. I spent last summer at Earl Bell's for two weeks and started from scratch, literally went to 0 steps and backed up slowly from there. I understand the way I vault, but I wouldn't really call it a model, it's more of common sense to me, basically finding out how to get the most recoil out of the pole and how to put my body in the right spot so I can be an extension of the pole. Thanks for your input, I appreciate it.
If you're gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough.


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